What Think Ye of FSY?

My sense from the other end is that they’re aggressively hiring those 18-28-year-olds to be counselors, which gives them a) a chance to travel for the summer and meet new people, and b) a gospel-oriented environment to work in. I know very little about the FSY program, but that’s my take on it.

Yes, E.C., I know a young couple, married a couple years, expecting their first child, who meet as FSY counselors flown out to work in Virginia. So, that is one cheer for bureaucratizing.

Also, as another data point: There is a large push, at least in my SE Va. Stake, to have local YSA be FSY counselors. Not a lot of interest from the target YSA, from what I understand, but strong encouragement.

This is off-topic for EFY/FSY, but very much on-topic for bureaucratization of everything. I’m struggling with it, and it is a touchy subject regardless, so I’m hoping someone has some insight that will help. I’ve recently learned that our soon-to-happen temple groundbreaking will be entirely planned and executed by people from church headquarters. (I assume some local leaders will be included in the program, but no-one local will have anything to do with the planning.) I am a faithful ordinance worker in a near-by temple, and am very grateful and excited about the opportunity to work closer to home, but I just don’t see how excluding local influence from the temple serves any useful purpose. It feels very much like bureaucratic overreach. Another example concerning temples is the move to get rid of all locally hand-crocheted cloths used in the temple, to be replaced with standardized, plain cloths that will be used throughout the world. I’m not going inactive or anything, but it causes sadness.

I also feel the face to face livestreams are way overproduced.

It’s a shame a 3 hour podcast with a comedian/fighter/announcer is almost always more interesting that anything the church produces.

Its not because the gosepl isn’t rich enough, or the general authorizes don’t have interesting lives or experiences.

Its a shame in the age of authentic long format conversations we have mostly scripted pause-and-smile for the camera performances.

From what I’ve seen about FSY, the stakes do a lot of the work. I have already seen announcements looking for local YSAs to be counselors for local FSYs.
As for the temple groundbreaking, I wouldn’t worry about the fact that Salt Lake is doing the planning. Temples are a very big deal, and they have learned a lot about what to do and what not to do in the whole process from groundbreaking to open house to dedication and beyond. Even the cleaning after it is in operation. Some things benefit a lot from the experience they have at headquarters.

“Leave it to the professionals” is certainly seductive, especially if we fund the professionals, keep the stake budgets extremely modest, and tell people they are prohibited from spending their own money to carry out things they want to see happen.

We are not quite to the level of “you may not bring homemade cupcakes without certification that your kitchen passed a county health inspection and all who prepare food in your kitchen have completed training in health, safety, and prevention of sexual harassment and trafficking in persons,” but we’re getting there.

I think the Brethren are trying to change church culture. And they are not doing it solely through the adults; they are going directly to the children and youths too.

I think the FSY reps from church HQ are going out to train (by example) the local adults how to lead/teach the youth as well as directly teach the youth.

It may be part of the continuing effort to stem the loss of teens and young adults.

I noticed that the June 2021 Leadership Training video on Love-Share-Invite
( https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/video/sharing-the-gospel/2021-06-0100-love-share-invite-1080p?lang=eng )
had an over-representation of children/teens among the remote participants. I think it was saying to the local leaders (after all it was a “leadership training video” not a “youth training video”) that they need to take the L-S-I message to children/teens.

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Here is some evidence that the Brethren are changing church culture. Watch this from the beginnig, but the pull-quotes from Elder Cook start at 1:00 in:
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/how-to-share/introducing-love-share-and-invite?lang=eng

He uses the words “to think and do things from a fresh perspective.” Granted, that is in direct reference to sharing the gospel. Then he goes on to say “sharing the gospel in a better way will require a change in our culture.”

I would venture that their efforts to change church culture are not being linited to sharing the gospel with non-members. I think the cultural changes are extending to how parents and local leaders are bringing up the next generation. It has to change because the trends in retention have not been good.

“I don’t like the aesthetic of the Face-to-Face events that the church produces, which feature theater kids sharing a stage with apostles and bringing the apostles down to their level”

Then were there brought unto him little children, that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them. But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven. And he laid his hands on them, and departed thence.

Why did Jesus stoop to the level of the Children?

StC, when I wrote “their level” I was not thinking about their age. I was thinking about their showbiz style. Most youth are not Disney Channel caricactures, but the ones some producer would think of placing on a stage for an hour trend in that direction. “Some producer” is another part of what I mean.

On the other hand, maybe their age is part of it too: I am thinking of one I saw where Elder Bednar pushed against the format. A youth asked a youthful question about Sabbath observance, and Elder Bednar somewhat berated the youth for asking the question and instead of answering it, Bednar used it as a starting point to teach something else he considered worthy of discussion. The observant reader of the New Testament may note from whom Elder Bednar may have borrowed that technique.

JM, when the organizational church starts doing something new, it takes a few years to grow into it and eventually “get it right.”

Progress has been made. They now do limited-area pilot projects in order to develop a new “thing” into something more mature before rolling it out church-wide.

Old examples I am thinking of include “welfare missionaries” (1980’s) which eventually grew into something meaningful, and the 2000 era web site and online store, which eventually had experienced professionals put in charge.

Films/videos have also made great strides since the amateurish production values and naive cultural contexts of the ones from the 70’s and 80’s.

I agree with you about some of the recent video stuff being somewhat “cringe” in terms of scripting, and either wooden performances on one hand or “over acting” on the other. I just try to remember that our leaders are not professional actors nor professional MCs/presenters. Though some such as Elders Holland and Uchtdorf can be dynamic speakers.

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There is also the issue of making something that is relevant to and approachable from a worlwide audience. Especially born-in-church versus converts, and intermountain-west versus elsewhere, and North America versus elsewhere. It can be hard to impossible for a BiC Utah-bound producer to come up with something relatable to a convert in Peoria, let alone Portugal. Even into the 2000’s some of the Ensign/Liahona magazine covers were face-palmingly cringe, because the designer didn’t think how people other than BiC-Utahns would see it.

There are also linguistic restraints in effect. One is just plain vocabulary. Vocabulary for a wide audience needs to be kept at an 8th-grade level, or lower. Same with grammar and sentence structure – 8th grade mainly. This is not just for the widely varying education levels and “cultural contexts” in the US, but it needs to be kept simple for translation purposes, and the even more varying educational levels, and even broader cultural contexts of the whole world.

Us “culturally sophisticated and well-educated” [snort snort] online denizens are a tiny fraction of the audience that the Brethren want to reach.

The funny thing is, JM, I read your headline and before I read further stopped to think what I thought about fsy.

My thoughts:
-I hate the centralizing and uniformity tendencies we have going on these days
-the youth broadcast they did to introduce the program was spectacularly bad
-I loathe EFY
-putting a broader pool of LDS youth together is great

Annie,

Same with the artwork. It bugs me.

In everything, down with the managers and the professionals

G, my comment was already too long and negative, or I would have mentioned the artwork. sigh. But thanks for saying that. I know I’m not alone.

@Annie:

“Another example concerning temples is the move to get rid of all locally hand-crocheted cloths used in the temple, to be replaced with standardized, plain cloths that will be used throughout the world. ”

Talk to your temple president about that. My guess is that such items, whether standardized or locally produced, tend to turn into “relics” when they are retired. And when the item is retired, sometimes temple workers keep the item, and then people tend to venerate and brag about the items. Perhaps there have been occasions where members, relatives of the person who made it, fought over who gets to keep it.

I can easily understand why the Brethren don’t want “temple relics” floating around, if that is the case.

jrganymede morphed into BCC so slowly, I barely noticed.

StC, that is a good concern to keep in mind. If BCC is a collection of people insisting Israel should have a king like other nations, some of us here at JrG have a tendency, after Saul has been annointed, to wish our nation of priests to continue as such. Jacob chapter 5 is one of the truest scripture passages I know: nothing done to build up the kingdom of God works altogether and nothing works for long. On the broad way leading to destruction, I can be right about a true principle, and wrong in how I choose to hold on to it when the master has decided it is time let it pass away from a world that rejects it.

StC,

Wait till you see all the festivities we have planned for pride month.

I think the church takes away the opportunity for members to be involved in reverent, worshipful work when they give all the work of temple building and preparation to strangers 100s of miles away. There is deep value in encouraging a feeling of ownership and responsibility from the members of a temple district. It’s part of living the law of consecration.

What I want to know is why is June Pride Month? Shouldn’t it be August? Since, you know, pride goeth before the Fall?

…

I’ll show myself out.

Robert, that is exactly the kind of humor we need.

I don’t believe sustaining the Brethren means being completely uncritical of them, at any level of the church. We need to hold their arms up, not just cheer at them while their arms are wobbling! In past decades of the Church there was more of this, especially at local levels (old-timers have lots of stories of pushing back against bishops who maybe should have prayed a bit more or counciled with more councils before assigning a calling). Part of the general disenchantment of the modern age has led to a knee-jerk enchantment of many callings that absolutely depend on returning and reporting.

I’m not talking about “trickle-up revelation” or anything ridiculous like that, more a suggestion that if we let our lights shine and set up programs that work very well, even if we’re not allowed to use meetinghouses or tithing funds, we might be able to provide assistance for our leadership in a bold way.

Does Sustaining mean to be silent?
Or is speaking up part of helping?

I am certainly not talking about steadying the ark or opposing the Brethren. But they have said, Good Revelation depends on good information. We should share what we know and what we see, and then follow the Brethren, even if it is contrary to what think. Even if we are correct and they are wrong, the Lord will bless us for our obedience.

I honestly think this is why the Muslims have been so blessed throughout history. They were obedient to the prophet they were sent, who was divinely inspired, even if not in everything. So, even if Mohammad went astray, his people were blessed for following his words.