D&C Bits — Holy Men Ye Know not of
D&C 49
D&C 49:8 It is my will that all men repent. Properly understood, this is formally the same as his work and glory being to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man.
49:8 “Holy men ye know not of.” Extremely intriguing. Who or what are these people?
49:16 “One flesh”=sex. This and the immediate verses are one spouse => sex => “fulfill measure (i.e. children)
D&C 50
50:2-3 False spirits different from Satan? His kingdom seems shambolic.
D&C 50:12 Our reasoning is only human reasoning? Only a simulacra of logic?
50:31 If God doesn’t help you know the spirit, its not of God. I think that would normally take the form of synergy, of making connections. And of feeling to repent even more.
50:43 Interesting to compare to v.22
50:33 Compare with v. 22 re rejoicing. Is rejoicing a communal emotion? One that opens you to the Spirit?
D&C 51
D&C 51:17 “As if you were going to live here many years” – a beautiful temporal principle with strong spiritual overtones. I wonder sometimes if the Saints have inhaled too much of an otherworldly spirit from old christianity. Or maybe put in a better way–its not that we have too much of an otherworldly spirit, since you cannot have too much of that, but maybe we don’t have enough of a temporal spirit to go along with that? A lot of times what passes as temporal wisdom is too measly and mewling to be worthy of this creation.
Bookslinger
June 15, 2021
49:8 “Holy men ye know not of.” Extremely intriguing. Who or what are these people?
They likely existed in most ages, even in times of general apostasy. The Venerable Bede could have been one. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bede
Whatever light or “embers” were extant, they helped preserve it, setting up the grand chain of events that was necessary for the Restoration.
Even today, I think they are sprinkled among all religions, perhaps even some among no formal religion — people of utter purity and piousness, who don’t have the full truth, but who are so pure and righteous they qualify as holy.
I think there are both big-picture and little-picture reasons for this.
I believe some holy men serve/lead a certain set of the Lord’s sheep who are capable of receiving some degree of light but who are not presently capable of the fuller light of the Restoration. I’ve met some Catholic priests who I think are in this category — perhaps the Lord keeps those priests in the Catholic church to feed/serve His sheep there. Many of those sheep are not ready for the fullness of the Restoration yet. I believe the same is true of all religions, including non-Abrahamic religions — better to have some portion, even a sliver, of light than no light. Pres Hinckley said all religions have at least some particle of truth. (I’m not saying all priests/ministers/leaders of other religions are holy men.)
And some holy men and women are in the rank and file of those religions. For some, I think the Lord “parks” them there, because if He brought them in, they would assimilate some of our bad habits. IOW, they are so good/pure, maybe we collectively aren’t good enough for them. I’ve met some rank-and-file Hindus in this category. They were ultra-pure, so pure they gave off light that immediately caught my attention. Some were temple-worker or Stake-president-level shiny. One couple was apostle-level shiny. I recall two specific Caucasian-American non-LDS Christian ladies working as gas-station cashiers. I recall two African-American ladies in the waiting room of a car repair shop.
Bookslinger
June 15, 2021
“False spirits different from Satan? His kingdom seems shambolic.”
Yes. pan-demon-ium.
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/pandemonium
Pandemonium definition, wild uproar or unrestrained disorder; tumult or chaos.
Bookslinger
June 15, 2021
50: “32 And it shall be given unto you, power over that spirit; and you shall proclaim against that spirit with a loud voice that it is not of God—
33 Not with railing accusation, that ye be not overcome, neither with boasting nor rejoicing, lest you be seized therewith.”
Heaven still mourns over the 1/3rd.
Bookslinger
June 15, 2021
Unclear antecedent: Where I wrote: “who are capable of receiving some degree of light but who are not presently capable of the fuller light of the Restoration”
I was referring to some of the rank-and-file of other churches.
Many/some ministers/leaders in other churches are capable of receiving the fuller light of the Restoration (all the Lord needs to do is flip the switch — examples are in the scriptures). But they have a holy calling/assignment to minister where they are.
G
June 15, 2021
Books, thanks for the time you put into that thoughtful response. There’s wisdom you had there.
Bookslinger
June 15, 2021
I forgot to give credit: Some of those ideas were from the 7-part series of Ensign articles “How the Bible Came to Be”, by Lenet H. Read, January through August 1982.
Rozy
June 15, 2021
Bookslinger – That 7 part series about the Bible is one of my favorite from the Ensign. I wish they’d have published more like that. Your comments brought to mind 1 Nephi 14:14 “. . . the power of the Lamb of God, . . .descended upon the saints of the church of the Lamb [one group of people], and upon the covenant people of the Lord [another group of people], who were scattered upon all the face of the earth; and they were armed with righteousness and with the power of God in great glory.” In verse 10 The angel tells Nephi that there are two churches only: the church of the Lamb of God, and the church of the devil. I’ve long concluded that, first, church doesn’t refer to specific religions as we know them, but to groups, organizations, associations, political parties, governments, etc. and second, that there are good, pure, and holy people everywhere. We who are covenant people of the Lord should be making allies with all of those who belong to the church of the Lamb. Together we can fight the church of the devil and rescue our brothers and sisters from the evil one. (Also, Book, I got that book you recommend and read the suggested chapters; it was great, and I hope I can put into practice what I learned, thanks for sharing.)